leonardcohenforum.com

I really liked Tony's response, too. I like all of his responses, but this one was particularly good. He has an exceptional gift for speaking volumes, together with using very few words. A gen-u-wine sharp shooter. Hmmmm.. speaking of wine.
B

This is the best I can do Bobbie
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/sample ... TF8#disc_4

It has samples too

Bobbie far as I can tell the songs he did not write are

Me & Bobby McGee (Kris Kristofferson)
Ring them Bells (Robert Zimmerman)
Changes (Phil Ochs??)
This is my Song (??)
The Auctioneer (??a country singer whose name I cant remember at the moment)
On Susan's Floor (??)
The First Time I Ever Saw Your Face(??)

Kush wrote:The First Time I Ever Saw Your Face(??)

Ewan MacColl, written for Peggy Seeger, if my mem'ry serves me well

Tim

The late Shel Silverstein wrote "On Susan's Floor." His songs have a deep insight into the nature of things. He was, inter alia, a cartoonist, author,
poet and also wrote children's stories. There is a very good site at http://www.banned-width.com/shel/misc/lyrics.html

It is worth looking at the words of "Rosalie's Good Eats Cafe" for his understanding of the human condition.

Thank you, Tri-me, Kush, Tim, and Tony... good to learn a few things I had no idea about.

Tony, the Silverstein site is indeed worth having a look at. As recommended, I read the lyrics to Rosalie's Good Eats Cafe (both the long and short) - and yeah, he really did have quite an understanding of the human condition. I guess he was an "observer". I read, as well, a couple other ones.. Racquel Welch, Red Neck Hippie Romance, and Still Gonna Die. (my sentiments, exactly.. ) His lyrics remind me of the things Tom Waits writes about - the every day lives and circumtances of ordinary people. Really good. Thank you for sharing.

B

Well this thread led me to purchase Gord's Gold Vol. 1......

Don Quixote


Through the woodland, through the valley
Comes a horseman wild and free
Tilting at the windmills passing
Who can the brave young horseman be
He is wild but he is mellow, he is strong but he is weak
He is cruel but he is gentle, he is wise but he is meek

Reaching for his saddlebag, he takes a battered book into his hand
Standing like a prophet bold, he shouts across the ocean to the shore
Til he can shout no more

I have come o'er moor and mountain, like the hawk upon the wing
I was once a shining knight, who was the guardian of a king
I have searched the whole world over, looking for a place to sleep
I have seen the strong survive and I have seen the lean grown weak

See the children of the earth, who wake to find the table bare
See the gentry in the country, riding off to take the air

Reaching for his saddlebag, he takes a rusty sword into his hand
Then striking up a knightly pose, he shouts across the ocean to the shore
Til he can shout no more

See the jailor with his key, who locks away all trace of sin
See the judge upon the bench, who tries the case as best he can
See the wise and wicked ones, who feed upon life's sacred fire
See the soldier with his gun, who must be dead to be admired

See the man who tips the needle, see the man who buys and sells
See the man who puts the collar, on the ones who dare not tell
See the drunkard in the tavern, stemming gold to make ends meet
See the youth in ghetto black, condemned to life upon the street

Reaching for his saddlebag, he takes a tarnished cross into his hand
Then standing like a preacher now, he shouts across the ocean to the shore
Then in a blaze of tangled hooves, he gallops off across the dusty plain
In vain to search again, where no one will hear

Through the woodland, through the valley, comes a horseman wild and free
Tilting at the windmills passing, who can the brave young horseman be
He is wild but he is mellow, he is strong but he is weak
He is cruel but he is gentle, he is wise but he is meek


Bitter Green


Upon the bitter green she walked the hills above the town
Echo to her footsteps as soft as eider down
Waiting for her master to kiss away her tears
Waiting through the years

Bitter Green they called her
Walking in the sun
Loving everyone that she met
Bitter Green they called her
Waiting in the sun
Waiting for someone to take her home

Some say he was a sailor who died away at sea
Some say he was a prisoner who never was set free
Lost upon the ocean he died there in the mist
Dreaming of her kiss

Bitter Green they called her
Walking in the sun
Loving everyone that she met
Bitter Green they called her
Waiting in the sun
Waiting for someone to take her hand


But now the bitter green is gone, the hills have turned to rust
There comes a weary stranger, his tears fall in the dust
Kneeling by the churchyard in the autumn mist
Dreaming of a kiss

Bitter Green they called her
Walking in the sun
Loving everyone that she met
Bitter Green they called her
Waiting in the sun
Waiting for someone to take her home

(I know you read the lyrics from Tri_me's site but I just felt like posting them anyway )

Ha ha

Just re-reading this thread and if leonard's worth is measured by janis sucking him off, then there must be a lot of great men out there.. rofl
Seriously, I think leonard would be the first to say that comparing him and gordon lightfoot is like comparing janis and joni mitchell--two very different and very talented men. I agree that Leonard is very deep possibly deeper than even he knows, but I believe that so are we all, and leonard sends that message in his music and poetry. I also believe and hope that he would blanch at the very idea of a comparative study between two very different artists. And anyway , who says simplicity isn't deep eh?

st theresa wrte:
>. . . if leonard's worth is measured by janis sucking him off, then there must be a lot of great men out there.

Well, I don't think it's such a bizarre yard-stick. Leonard's memory of the episode can fall into one of three possible attitudes. He either regrets it, he remains indifferent - or he is proud. We know he is neither regretful nor indifferent because he delights in singing 'Chelsea Hotel #2' at every concert. He knew as he sat there with the famous Janis Joplin between his knees that he had reached the climax of his career. He knows that for as long as time exists he'll always be spoken of in the same breath as great men such as Bill Clinton, Kris Kristofferson, Hugh Grant, etc. I am fully aware that it's not polite to honestly compare one artiste with another, because one of them always ends up inferior. God forbid that Gordon Lightfoot should ever tune into this station and see that I am blatantly calling a spade a spade - but in this case I have to, I'm afraid. It takes courage to be outspoken, but I dare to say it: Leonard Cohen is better than Gordon Lightfoot - in every respect! I am willing to risk my reputation as a gentleman in order to declare what is right. Nobody ever sucked Gordon off, as far as I am aware. He had to go to the bathroom and use his hand every day - but Leonard got his act together. He knew what a woman was created for, and that's why he is revered by them today.

Dear Geoffrey ~

He knew what a woman was created for, and that's why he is revered by them today.

I know you mean well with this theory of yours , which at least suggests [since you weren't specific in your remark] "a vehicle for sexual satisfaction." My experience is contrary to it, however; I fell in love with Leonard's words, voice, and music upon my first hearing of the first song I ever listened to by him ~ Suzanne ~ and it related to sexual abstention and the value of mind and spirit connection. It was revolutionary in its timing, appearing during the 'free love' period of the Sixties.

I could go on by citing other songs I'm in love with, as evidence contrary to your theory, but I'll leave it at "Suzanne"... the powerful cornerstone of my nearly 40-year love affair with Leonard's work.

I believe St. Theresa makes an excellent point .

I revere Leonard's writing, singing, and music; however, not for the reasons you seem to suggest.

I still agree with your contrasting of Leonard and Gordon, of course; but when we have one Leonard Cohen, we don't need another, anyway. Gordon has been a supreme Gordon Lightfoot, and I believe that the vast majority of artists want most to be recognized as being like themselves. I've never sensed that Gordon aspired to be Leonard, so in that sense, it's moot.

~ Lizzy

Geoffrey

My understanding of Leonard's work is obviously very different from yours. But I found your interpretation of that song interesting and likely very revelatory of who you are. In good art we find who we are.
I am sorry if I offended you with my off-handed dismissal of your ideas. The male perspective never ceases to surprise me even though I was raised with five brothers. A lot of what you suggest about leonard is certainly there in his early work through the 70's and early 80's but I think the much deeper spiritual stuff has always been there and has blossomed since his time in the monastery. --My reading --but the complexity of his work always makes me wonder if even he gets what he is saying. Or if some greater mind is not coming to us through his art/. In this sense Gordon Lightfoot's music sends much gentler and loving messages, but are they therefore less valid? His latest album, Dear Heather is much simpler but I believe a culmination of his work-not less important.

"Speaking quietly but unguardedly, Cohen appears amused when discussing his lifelong dislike for blue jeans, his following among young “punksters” and his regrets about once revealing that “Chelsea Hotel” was written about a sexual encounter with Janis Joplin. “She wouldn’t have minded, but my mother would have minded,” he says of his indiscretion."

Source : http://www.jewishjournal.com/home/preview.php?id=15274

Permit me to be not as convinced as the author about Cohen's "ungardedness". But ey!

Geoffrey you are so full of prejudices (but It would be more accurate to say that your posts are) in regard of sexuality that you can even not understand how a man like Cohen - and women like Janis - could have a sexual life without being restrained by such prejudices. This is funny. But not for you I guess.

***

Lightfoot and Cohen. Cohen and Diamond. (He is the only one not to have a poetic name but to do real one (poetry).) As long as Baby boomers will spend good money on the iconic figures of their youth, they will spread the papers with them. And offer special "have one get the other for free" as well.

Happiness is a warm plastic toy from McDonald.

Lets face it : some money are spent more wisely ay some times than another in term of buying what we get told. Indeed.

Wonderful photograph of two giants - different but hiant in their difference.
I thought I remembered Leonard saying in an interview that he regretted naming Janis Joplin as the woman in the Chelsea Hotel because of that "giving me head" line. May be wrong but I think he did say it.
I don't think that taking that line out and making it central is what that song is about. Yes it's a personal sexual act and memory but I think in the song context it fits with the notion that "we are ugly but we have the music" - that some things are available to the beautiful winners; some to all and some to the (suppposedly) ugly.
To judge anyone (and I'm not being prudish here -far from it) by the blow jobs they've given or received is a dubious yardstick (if you'll excuse the unintended pun).

but I dare to say it: Leonard Cohen is better than Gordon Lightfoot - in every respect!

probably true I dont know.

Only thing that matters is what I like hearing....and I am quite happy liking a lesser musician more than a better one.

Seems to me this discussion is not about LC vs. GL but about LC fans vs. GL fans. Who has the better and more sophisticated musical taste? Coz thats the only thing that validates our lives...since we dont create any of it thats worthwhile

It is nice to Anjani to have sent this picture of Leonard Cohen and Gordon Lightfoot. It is nice to see how fans of both are enjoying it. Is this really had to turned into a "versus" version, in the style of my-father-is-more-strong-than-your-father?

Please allow me to use another picture of Leonard Cohen to picture what I feel about this? Thank you.